![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png){kind=small}
Star Trek lore (not Lore) question
We're in the habit of bouncing around between streaming services -- turning them off when we aren't using them, turning them back on for something specific, forgetting to turn them off again... One of our on-and-offers is Paramount+, since the only shows I care about on there all have Star Trek in the name. I'd seen the first two seasons of Discovery and kept meaning to get back to it, but somehow I never did and suddenly I was two seasons behind. Finally, the release of Picard S2 inspired us to resubscribe, but for long story reasons we haven't actually watched that yet; instead, we watched Lower Decks Season 1 (and so far the first episode of S2) and I got back to Discovery - I've now watched the first 7 or 8 eps of Season 3.
I'm enjoying it, but something about the lore has been nagging at me, something I don't dare look up because I'm sure any site that might be helpful would also be full of spoilers, not just for Disco S3 and S4 but for Strange New Worlds. So I come to you, my faithful DW friends, for answers. It's about the Andorrians and the Orions and their relationship to the Federation. A bit of context first: my Trek fandom has always been centered around the TNG era -- mainly TNG and especially DS9, but I've also seen all of Voyager and the first two or three seasons of Enterprise. However, my knowledge of the TOS era is reeeeeally shaky -- I've seen some of the movies, and a very few episodes, but I don't have the lore at my fingertips at all.
As mentioned above, I'm hoping to get this answer with no spoilers for Discovery S3 or S4, or Strange New Worlds (or Lower Decks S2, if that happens to be relevant). But feel free to spoil anything and everything about TOS -- I recognize the statute of limitations is long up there.
So I don't know much about the Orions, but I feel like the Andorrians were members of the Federation during the TOS era, and probably the TNG era as well, although we didn't see them much. But no one in the 32nd century is talking about the Andorrians as former Federation members who left the fold, and obviously they come up a lot because they're so important to the Golden Chain. There's a whole different feel around how the Starfleet survivors talk about, say, the Vulcans, than they do the Orions or Andorrians. And the Discovery crew doesn't seem to feel that kind of connection either -- there's no shock the way there is when they learn that the Vulcans have left. So am I missing something? Or am I right to find this strange, and there is a disconnect that may or may not be explained later?
Many thanks!
no subject
This is based on limited knowledge on my part, and some quick reading. Andoria was not fully in the federation like Vulcan was. Vulcan was a founding member. Andoria formed an alliance to be part of the federation, but was not fully in. Probably similar to the Federation/Klingon relationship. I'm not sure Andoria were ever "members" but they had a friendly relationship.
Enterprise was set during the time Andoria was forming a relationship with the Federation. Archer was one of the first ambassadors to Andoria.
no subject
Thanks! I vaguely recall that Andorians were involved in later seasons of Enterprise, but after I stopped watching (in part because I'd heard that TPTB didn't feel particularly constrained by events that happened later in canon).
no subject
Having watched all of Enterprise...good choice.
no subject
no subject
I had forgotten about that line, but now that you mention it, I remember it as well. Thanks for the memory jog!
no subject
But yes, the Andorians were Federation members during TOS. Orion was not.
no subject
Thanks! I wonder if Orion ever joined. I do remember that there was an Orion crew member on the Enterprise in at least the first AOS movie, although that doesn't mean anything -- there have always been various Starfleet officers from non-Federation worlds.
no subject
Right after AOS STIX there were several excellent Gaila backstory character study fics about how she might have gotten to the Federation and the Academy.
HA! I found it. From Memory Alpha ...
She is never explicitly referenced on-screen as an Orion; that information comes from production materials. Unlike past Orion women, who had black hair, Gaila had red hair. The decision to give her that hair color was made by Barney Burman, who was also involved in designing her makeup as well as those of other aliens in the film Star Trek. "I gave her red hair because she looked hot with green skin and red hair," laughed Burman. "When [Makeup Department Head] Mindy Hall saw that," Burman remembered, "she said, 'Yeah, they [Orions] have to have red hair!' We pitched that to production and J.J. [Abrams] loved the idea!" (Star Trek Magazine issue 155, p. 57)
no subject
Thanks! I never knew that; interesting info.
I see you haven't watched Lower Decks, but the Cerritos definitely has an Orion crew member, and I just watched an S2 episode confirming that her people aren't Federation during the 24th century -- she joined Starfleet on her own. My question was more idle speculation about the hundreds of years between the 24th century and the Burn (a 30th century catastrophe that sets up the worldstate of Disco S3).
no subject
This was mentioned in "Journey to Babel" one of my favorite TOS episodes! Recommended if you would like to see how disfunctional Spock's family is. (Also why I found it believable that Spock would just never mention Michael even pre season 2 finale)
no subject
As for why the difference of reaction: there are probably two factors. In-story, Michael grew up on Vulcan, so she's probably more affected by its leaving. Out-of-story, the audience is probably more familiar with the Vulcans than with the Andorians.
no subject
That does make sense, although I have the vague memory that Andorians were more significant in the TOS era (but of course never as significant as Vulcan). The in-story reasoning explains the reaction of Michael, but less so the rest of the crew. It's possible that I missed something early on, or maybe it'll come up later. I'll be curious to see if they ever deal with it.
no subject
Thanks for the rec! I will bear it in mind if I ever decide to sample some more TOS.